The Fierce Business Babe Podcast Ep 90: Ads & Client Attraction With Danielle Klemm
In today’s episode I have a very special guest, Danielle Klemm, and we will be talking about everything to do with ads! She will be sharing with us tons of goodies about getting started with ads, when and how to use ads in your business and so much more!
Ads & Client Attraction with Danielle Klemm
By: Melissa Lin
Today, I have a very special guest with me, Miss Danielle Klemm. Danielle is an ads and conversion strategist for online coaches and course creators. She helps online entrepreneurs create a stream of ready to buy leads, sell out programs and all while getting their time back. How amazing is that! Through strategy, educating, and creating content; all around these topics, She's helped women be seen as an expert in their field and make more strides and sales in their businesses. We're so excited to have you here with us. Welcome. Welcome Danielle! I am so excited. And I love digging into strategy and all of those things.
I found that my end started a couple of years ago, when, I think, I was actually in my last semester in college. And I had that inevitable question about, like, what do I want to do next? And I always knew that I wanted to really help people. And I didn't really know exactly how I was going to do that, but I just knew that was internally me and I was a bit of a virtue-er. So I was getting like a double major. I think like H.R. and business management. So at the last minute, I decided to drop it, like two classes away from getting a double major, because I didn't really want to do it. When it comes to, I think the two classes were accounting based and we did like four before that. And it really helped kick start for me “Ok. If I'm going to drop this. I need to have some type of idea what I want to do next.” You know, four months from now, I'm going to be graduating and it kind of led me down a path of, OK, how do I start going through this? And I actually had one of the people I was seen to was like a spiritual healer of sorts. She needed help with social media and like just online organization. And that was kind of the first taste of, oh, this is actually really interesting. Like, I can get compensated for it and it really led me down, I think I did, I started going into website design and then into somewhere else, oh, graphic design too.
Something that was really interesting for me when I first started, when I was doing website designed. Typically, people would obviously want a really beautiful website, but my biggest thing was, I don't want to create a website for you that doesn't get you conversions or doesn't get you actual new customers. It's just a pretty billboard. So that's when my kind of love for conversions or like real results came and I started learning about opt-ins and lead magnets and all of these kind of things you add in, and slowly starting to make my way over to actual ads. I think it moved from website design a little bit to Instagram because I got some good traction on there. I had clients come to me through hash tags when that was really helpful during that time and, you know, I really want to help people to see real success. But like, actual consistent success, that is not taking up so much of their time. And one of my coaches actually was taught, and she had learned from one of her coaches I think, Ads. So she taught me and I'm like, oh, I'm actually kind of good at this.
It led me down this path of “OK, if I'm good at this, let me see if I can actually make money at it.” And I realized there's a good demand for people who want to learn more about ads, but also want to learn it in a way that's more holistic. It's not just slapping up an ad and like fingers crossed, it works. But actually having all the puzzle pieces come together. You're getting quality people, not just like a mass amount of people who aren't going to convert later.
I've been doing ad work. I would say, I started doing it about three years ago and then been doing it for clients and for myself for about two years. But I mean, it just kicked off. I talked about ads once and got the client, like that's how it first started. So it's just like the first moment and then it just began.
I find that for a lot of people, obviously for your business, it's always gonna depend on you. But I think even more so, like there are certain cues, both inner and outer cues, that can help you see if you are on the track to start ads soon. And one of the first things, which actually plays well into what we just talked about on my podcast, was making sure you really know your ideal client through and through, because one of the best things about ads is that they're going to be able to help you easily identify and find more people. But if you don't know who your people are, you're just going to be like casting a really wide net and it's just not going to be super beneficial for you.
So the first thing is like really knowing your ideal client, like knowing what they're going through, knowing who they follow. Knowing these things are really important. Just in general for business, but especially for ads. Second thing I would say is, knowing the offer that you're trying to sell, even if you start with a free offer and then later going to a paid offer, knowing that you've tested that offer. You've had people go into that offer before and or for your if you're doing like a freebie or lead magnet, that you make sure people are actually signing up organically first, because I'm always a believer of making sure that it's working through organic first before you go to ads. I don't want you to spend money on things that are going to take up more of your time or much more testing than you really need. That's why it's really helpful to have that organic piece. Those are the two biggest things outer wise. And then the last couple of things I would say would be making sure that you actually have some type of audience starting out, because that's how you're going to be able to verify it already, you're freebie and your actual audience, because at the end of the day, you can and use them to, like, grow from scratch, but I usually never recommend it.
I'm going to be honest with people when it comes to that. Like, you know, you can but you're gonna be having to guess or like estimate a lot more than you need to. So having some type of follower base. I've had clients come to me who are like under a thousand followers. It's not really about the follower count or list count, it’s just about making sure that you've already had revenue or sales in your business. So most people come to me usually, it depends on if they're going for the done for you side of me, or the like done with you, or do it yourself. Most of them have already made like a couple thousand a month in their business. Usually they are at least around like 6k or over before they come to me, because at the end of the day, this is a marketing strategy. It's not meant to fix your business as much as it is to really amplify the good and bad. So I want to make sure that if you're gonna do ads, you have the best chance of success when it comes to reaping the results you're really wanting from them.
That's why I really love to come at it as a holistic piece, because so many people talk about just getting the ad up. At the end of the day, if that ad was going to go to a landing page and then they're going to go onto your list, Do you have a follow up sequence set up to help nurture them? To help them become a client versus just kind of like bringing people in? So I kind of teach with my clients, especially as done for you, people like that I actually help them to review their full sales funnel and everything like that before we even publish an ad. And for my done with you clients, too, because I want to make sure that, again, you have the best chance of that. But also, we want to make sure that the experience that they get with you, because for a lot of us people, it's going to be their first experience or impression of you, that it is a very smooth process, that they really resonate and that they're really nurtured on the way through.
Start first, ask yourself, you know, what type of client are you trying to bring in? So for example, like I mentioned, I have my done for you clients who are going to be higher earners. They're going to come in in a variety of ways. People who are done with you or do it yourself kind of like coaching. And a little bit of like teaching courses type of thing. They're gonna come in in slightly different ways. So the first thing is you have to address who you're wanting right now. And you can always do it like Melissa has, where you can have different variations of offers. But you need to know what offer you're currently selling right now to make sure that your marketing is really reflecting for that, too. So I would say that if you're going for a higher ticket one to one, people, make sure that the content you're doing is authority building. Like podcasts are wonderful, collaboration's or like video collaboration's or things like that. So good for that. Building out a referral network or building up just referral pieces for higher people. I find when I do Ads, If I'm going to try and bring in one to one clients from ads, it has to be very strategic because ads are really here to bring a lot more people to you vs. just like one or two high ticket clients. It can be done for sure, but I try to have a distinction of making sure that if I'm going to be addressing, I want more done for you clients right now. I know that those other areas I need to focus on more versus the done with you or do yourself, ads are so good for that. Like, they're so helpful for bringing in those types of people and nurturing them down the path.
I'd also say for them, try and think of other marketing strategies. I'm such a huge advocate for, like anything audio or video based just because you're really shortening that like know trust factor time, because they're really getting to know you, you see your face, your mannerisms, see how you talk. Like, I even right now, you can't see me. I'm waving my hands. I talk with my hands. And people really resonate with that, whether they do it or not, because it's you. So I would say as much as you can, If it's an alignment with you, try to see how you can add in more layers of audio or video or whatever that is for either client, because that's how you're gonna shorten that time from them going “I don't know who you are” to “OK. I know who you are. Now, I'm curious about your offer.”
Goodness. That's one of those things where, and I said this in the last podcast I was on to, it's like you're going to hate me sometimes because I'm going to say the word “It depends” a lot. There are certain things where each business owner and the number one goal that's going to be a little bit different. So let's say, for example, your people are wanting to do a launch soon for that. I would say doing some type of video. It could be a small video like under five minutes or 15 minutes. Most of the videos when you do ads to it, If it's to new people, they're probably not going to watch it longer than a minute. But if you go to warm, they're going to have a bit longer. So I would say don't try and attach like a full on like super long video to an ad thinking you're gonna get that much actual response from it. But allow yourself to realize, “OK, what would I need to see on a feed to go to the next step of your funnel or like your business offer”. For me, it's like, OK, if I was someone who wants to learn more about ads. What do I need to know first? And for a lot of people, it's going to be like, “are ads really the right time for me?” or “Are Facebook ads the right platform for me?” So that's why I created my ad experiment, because I need to help people see and show them why it was. So creating content like that, helping show them first, Show them like why your topic or what you do is important. And basing it on the thoughts they're having is a really good strategy, no matter paid or organic.
If it's your first time doing ads, I always recommend, audience growth is going to be your number one starting point, just because this is a thing that I talk about often. The bigger the ask, the bigger the cost. So the bigger the ask that you're asking those people to do, the higher cost it's going to be for you. So the lowest usually, which means like the easiest way to get them in and to have your ads be pretty successful is doing like a free guide or free download, a freebie of some sort, because they're just putting in their name and email and able to get the thing. A lot more people on Facebook, now too understand, like, that's going to be the normal transition, like normal exchange. So it's not as high priced and you're able to get more people in the door. For a lot of you, obviously, your number one thing is going to be sales. But the thing that comes before sales are clients. And how to get clients is get them in the door first and that's where audience growth comes in. So I always say starting with some type of thing like that, like free guide, free video, something like that is really helpful. If you get a little bit further down the road, doing some type of free challenge or free series is like one step up, because they're putting their name and email but they also have to commit more to watching the actual series or being on the Facebook group.
The last two pieces would then be webinars that are just crazy bananas high. No matter how good you do it, they're a bigger ask because again, it's still name and email, but it's you're having to have them watch, you know, 60, 90 minute videos and then they pretty much, most people, will know that there's gonna be a pitch at the end. So it's just that it's a higher cost because the bigger ask. And the last pieces usually are a mixture between like a free call. If it's true again to new people, if it's to your current audience, it's a little bit cheaper. And then the last piece is obviously a sale because it's a literal cost. It's a literal ask of the sales. So I would say start from bottom, then go up. So start with an audience growth piece, create the free guide, create the way that you want to bring them in. It could be even a free video, and use that to catapult you to help them get through that other the actual latter of it.
I would say, I'm going to go literal and then like an actual situation to help out. So a literal time to not use ads? I never say not to use ads. I'll say when ad costs are going to be higher. So you’re going to put a little bit more money to get the same results. So for a lot of the holidays, like November, December, you're going to have a really good jump of higher ad costs because there is going to be a lot more like the heavy hitters like Nordstrom's, J.C. Penney's. These people like shoveling thousands into ads to get those sales, like the Black Friday sales, the end of year sales ads that come through. So it's going to be a higher cost for that. So it's, again, not a “No, don't do it”. It's just you have to know that's going to be higher during that time. And then for, like a situational basis, when was it not the right time to run ads? Number one is, if you like, like you mentioned, if you have a free guide, but you don't have, like, at least some type of couple of emails set up afterwards, I wouldn't run the ad until those are set up, just because I don't want you to have people get on to your list and just become zombies, basically, where they're not going to be able to be nurtured or like really build that trust with you. So I would say that piece. But it's hard to say when not to. It's more like situational, I wouldn’t do it then. And obviously if you don’t have the money don't just, like, take out a loan to try and do ads.
So the first one's always gonna be, you know. So for those who have an Instagram business page or even like a Facebook business page, you'll see it when you do any posts on the bottom right of your actual post itself, It will have that blue button that says promote. And what that essentially is, is kind of like a boosted post where you're putting in money to have that reach more people. The problem is that's actually not really a Facebook ad. It’s not even in the Facebook ads manager, which is where the ads are held, because what you're doing is basically gambling that money, hoping that people will see it because that type of button is literally just Facebook trying to get money from those who don't know what ads are. It's really mean, I know, but it's just like that's Facebook's way of Like, “oh, put some money here. You'll see some results” and yeah, you'll probably have your aunt see it, who has been engaging on your post, but you're not able to target what you would an actual ad. So the blue button is called boosted posts. We don't like most posts. Remember that. Don't do it. You're not able to target it, who's actually going to see it. It's gonna be like your people who like your page or people who are like outside of it and you really can't go any deeper than that. Like, if people are liking your page, figures show that someone who's your aunt or someone that like a year ago doesn't really have the same needs anymore. So that's kind of why I like to make sure I say that first, because that's like the number one thing that's going to make it so hard for you to start. So that's one of the biggest ones.
The second thing I would say is not really knowing your actual goal. So I'm so happy you talked about this beforehand because so many people wanted to ads for the sake of like, I want to create new sales. And, like, that's amazing. Totally can do that. We need to do steps before that to get you there and know, OK, what is the first goal before that that we can actually hit so you can create sales? So I always find that one of the bigger mistakes is just doing ads or investing in ad courses or ad programs, not really knowing what the exact strategy is for you. One of the things around people who do DIY ad courses. It's not because the ad, of course, could be good or bad. It's because most people would teach it either from a general how to ad, which is just gonna get you general results or It's gonna be in a place that's not really helping you give a lot of feedback or a lot of personalization to your business. For example, like with Melissa, She could have another business coach and they could both have some type of a free guide, but Melissa's doing better or on the opposite side, the other girls ad didn't get approved, even though their typically the same thing. And I find that without having your goals set, without having someone there to, like, help champion you, both as a guide or as someone doing it for you, You just run into so many more headaches and then just a worse outlook on ads. So I'm going to lead with those as like the big ones.
So I would say the first thing is knowing why you want to do ads. So I really recommend, again, going back to your goal, having a specific goal, like I always ask my clients, what is the number one goal in the next 30 to 60 days that would make you jump up and down excited about if you got them from ads. Then work backwards from there just because, again, ads are really here to amplify. But they can amplify the things that either you want or don't want. And I'm here to try and help demystify that. So that's the first action step. The next action step I'm going to give is a little biased, but it's for good reason. So as you mentioned, I recently did an ad experiment. The audience growth ad experiment, where I tested Pinterest, LinkedIn and Facebook to help kind of like show you guys, for those who were doing audience growth, which means trying to get a free guide or trying to help grow your list or audience in general, what was the most bang for your buck and right when you signed up, right after, you'll be able to get literally the five biggest questions that I had helped break down. What should be your ad budget per day? What should be your goal or objective for ads? What should be your ad copy ideas? I give that there. So I just recommend for you guys to do that, not because I'm trying to promote it, just for the sake of like, I've helped so many people answer their questions through that. And until I find a better resource, I'm gonna have to say that, well, look, you can probably try and do it. But the thing with YouTube, again, those videos are going based off of general results and industries. They’re going to say ads for businesses versus for you as a coach. I'm here to help coaches and course creators. So all my content, all of the ads you're going to see in the ad experiment were based on targeting those people and using the same copy as that. So that's kind of why I'm kind of talking about that one little bit more.
I have a podcast called the Clients Convergence Podcast. Melissa is gonna be on it. Most likely you're going to hear it aired. So that's one of the best places to find me weekly. But social media wise, I'm usually on Instagram, @Danielleklemm. Then on Website, danielleklemm.com. So those are like the main places you can find me.
Thanks for hanging out with me today! Make sure to grab her freebie. You're going to get so many goodies from that freebie there. Thank you so much, Danielle, for being with us today and sharing so many of those goodies . If you love this episode, please share a screenshot on Instagram stories and let us know your biggest takeaway. Danielle would love to see it. I would love to see it as well. Hey, both of us. Danielle, we had such a blast with you.
Topics we cover include:
When to start doing Ads
How to get started doing ads
How long a facebook ad should be
The best type of ads for beginners
Avoiding common mistakes
And so much more!
Times to check out:
(6:03) Knowing when to start using Ads
(11:12) The best ways to get started using ads
(13:31) How long should an ad be?
(15:18) The best type of ads for beginners
(20:32) Common mistakes to avoid
GET IN TOUCH WITH DANIELLE:
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https://www.instagram.com/iamdanielleklemm
Website:
Facebook:
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Freebie: Audience Growth Ad Experiment:
https://www.danielleklemm.com/adexperiment
GET IN TOUCH WITH MELISSA:
Five Figure Launch:
https://www.themelissalin.com/five-figure-launch
Hot Leads Machine (new course):
https://www.themelissalin.com/hotleadsmachine
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